The Pope's visit

RedTaintedRose · Kitten Joined: 27 Apr 2007 Posts: 147

Stop snarking vern.

I have pointed out that it IS possible for abstinence to not work. The catholic example ; a virgin girl is impregnanted (no matter the source) shows that abstinence is not, in fact, 100% proven or effective.

EIther you can prove that it is, in which case you disprove the entire virgin birth thing, or you cannot, in which case it proves that abstience is not 100% effective.

Stop snarking and just provide your proof one direction or another.

SpaceMarine · Goldfish Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 63 Location: Phobos

RedTaintedRose,

So your argument is that abstinence doesn't work because God performed a miracle?

A miracle in Christian theology is such that God breaks the laws of this universe and bends them to His Will. If we are going to evoke God, then we have to accept that the laws of nature were broken, and that abstinence there for has to work, for God to break it. Otherwise, if abstinence didn't work, why would we attribute the Virgin conception as a miracle?

If you are going to evoke God and more specifically Christian Theology, we cannot pick and choose what we want to believe. We have to be consistent, specifically for arguments sake.

I would be more then willing to agree in that abstinence doesn't work against God's will, or against God, but as a general claim as if it doesn't work at all? Sorry, but that doesn't fit the facts, even in the Christian realm.

vernon · Hamster Joined: 05 Jul 2004 Posts: 89 Location: Oregon

I don't know what world redtaintedrose lives in, but certainly in my world there is no plethora of virgin pregnancies.

The bottom line is that abstinence works if it is practiced.

People who have sexual relations are not abstaining, so abstinence can't work for them if they refuse to practice it.